1961 Ranchero and I'm stumped

[toddrichert]

Well first things first, I am not only an amateur mechanic, but also an amateur internet user. I just joined here but I don't know the difference between a "forum" and a "blog" so if someone could tell me where is the best place to post my questions, I am probably in need of some guidance in the basics of website use.

As many of us did, I made the regretful mistake of letting my first car slip through my fingers. It was my dad's 1961 Ranchero that he bought new. It had a scarce but factory-issue interior that I thought I might never see again. One turned up on ebay with the same interior, and I immediately bought it, drove to Iowa and towed it back here myself (Shelton WA.) It was missing the drive train so I searched far and wide, then found a 1962 Ranchero on craigslist with complete drive train, 144 inline 6 with 3 on the tree, just like my dad's, drove to California and towed it back here also. The 62 looks like hell and has been heavily stripped, but miraculously under the hood was essentially complete; no engine parts had been vultured yet.

Before I swap the engine/transmission/drive shaft over to the 61, I wanted to see just how healthy the engine is first, and whether or not a custom rebuild might be a prudent choice. So I got the 62 running and have taken it on short test drives within a mile of home. (It isn't easy because the 62 has no seat and the brakes don't work, however the parking brake does work and I live out in the middle of nowhere with 3 miles of gravel road separating me from civilization.)

I checked compression and there is some worrying variance but not unexpected for the age, my pressures ranged from 120 to 145.

My next immediate concern was cooling system and the water pump turned out to be grinding. I pulled the cooling system apart and flushed everything until the water flowed clean, engine, radiator, heater core, and everything had very good water flow with no evidence of blockage or resistance. Replaced water pump and thermostat.

The charging system was working but putting out a little less than I liked, very much on the low end of barely acceptable. Swapped the regulator over from the 61 and got a whole 1 volt bump in output, now charging in the 14 to 14.5 range.

So that's a lot of background but here's where I am stumped. I'm afraid to run this engine more than a few minutes at a time unless I'm certain the oil is flowing properly. When I take the valve cover off, I'm seeing no evidence of oil actively getting to the top of the engine. The previous owner had installed a mechanical oil pressure gauge directly to the engine, in between the engine and the sending unit. This gauge shows 30 pounds at idle and up to 45 pounds when the RPMs go up. So I'm pretty sure I have a working oil pump in there.

I have done every search I can think of on google but unable to find an oil-flow diagram for 144, 170, or any of the Ford straight 6 engines.

Near the front of the engine, under the valve cover, there is a bolt which is clearly designed to double as oil passageway. It is tapered to be narrower than the opening, and at the top of the opening there is a little oil stream bed with a cover. It is obvious that the oil is meant to flow up in the gap around this bolt, across this narrow passageway, and down the adjacent opening onto the top of the engine. But it doesn't. With the engine off, I removed the bolt and put compressed air down into that bolt hole in case there is a blockage further down. It sounded like the air was blowing directly into a big open engine with no resistance whatsoever.

I am just stuck here and don't know what diagnostic to do next.

Do I actually have a working oil pump, or is it possible for the pressure gauge to show that much pressure when the oil pump is actually much weaker than it needs to be? Is there a possible blockage in the oil path to the top of the engine, and if so, how do I confirm it or find it? Is there an oil flow diagram out there somewhere which could help me in my research? Where do I find this type of technical information?

Any help from the more knowledgeable/experienced enthusiasts would be most extremely welcome!
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[Luva65wagon]

This is a rather elusive subject on these engines. I know from history they don't oil up top well, but have never really researched this much. I know they used to sell a kit to plumb into the oil pressure sending unit port to run another line up through the valve cover and to the rear rocker arm bolt to get oil flowing on both ends. And this wasn't an issue of low oil pressure, so much, as it was one of there being so much loss on all the lower bits of the engine it didn't make it up to the top very well. Probably an issue not noticed on newly built motors, but as things wore out it got worse.

Keep in mind, this oils the rocker arms. You have solid lifters and so there is no oil coming up through push rods like on most hydraulic lifter motors. Oil comes up and just flowed up around that bolt with the groove and down the rocker arm tube and spewed out wherever it could. And maybe it would reach the back rocker arms.

I just did a supplementary look as I wrote this in two sources I'm aware of; the Schjeldahl Ford Six Performance Handbook and the Classic In-lines tech page (online). Not a single mention. I'll do a little further research on this - need to anyway for an upcoming build I'm doing - and if I find out more I'll post it here, which is the best place to post questions. Blogs are good for something, but not sure what.

And welcome by the way...

[toddrichert]

Thank you so much! I just found an email about your message, 5 days later... fortunately the spam folder holds for quite awhile before purging, but now I know to check there.

In the meantime I did find an oiling diagram for a 200 straight 6 and as you'd suspect, it was the same design as the 144. Turned out the front bolt I had pulled was the end of the pathway, and it's positioned next to an overflow spout. The oil flows opposite direction of how I suspected, coming up past the rear (driver's side) head bolt and then forward to the front. Apparently it wasn't the first time this engine had such a problem because when I pulled out that rear head bolt, it had asymmetrical aftermarket grinding on the non-threaded portion:

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It was gummed up pretty good, but when I cleaned off the sides of that bolt and put it back exactly how I found it, viola! OIL FLOW! Within 2 minutes of firing up the engine, the oil was coming to the front and dripping out of the overflow spout, and also seeping out of the little hole in each one of the rocker arms.

Here's oil reaching the front of the engine for the first time in years:

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With oil flowing safely, I decided it was time to swap the engine over. Last night I pulled the engine and it was precarious. I could only find one lifting point on the driver's side that looked safe. On the passenger side, I found multiple locations. I also went and bought a load leveler to improve my chances. However in spite of my best efforts, the engine slipped twice. I feel I got off pretty lucky. The only thing broken was the exhaust manifold (I think.) And the exhaust manifold had some weird patchwork repair wired to it which I haven't removed yet, but I strongly suspect that underneath that patchwork is a hole or a crack, which is to say that I think the exhaust manifold probably already needed to be replaced anyway, so it kinda doesn't matter that I broke it more. The chain ended up leaning against the distributor at one point, and I caught the fuel pump apparatus rubbing against the engine mount, with decidedly more pressure than I was comfortable with. But I don't think either of them was misaligned or damaged.

The load leveler was surprisingly useless, near impossible to crank and didn't seem to be helping when it did try to shift the load. I might have been better off without it. After the second slip, the engine was hanging heavily askew to starboard. (Actually I don't know which side is starboard; I just thought a nautical term would sound funny here.) It was hanging heavily to the driver's side. So I didn't dare move it again until I had added a ratchet strap to cinch it back up straight, or at least closer to straight.

Anyway got the engine/transmission pulled out (somewhat) successfully as a single unit and then lowered onto a secure platform. Now thinking about my next steps.

The clutch lever had been removed from engine bay of the 61 Ranchero so that will have to be swapped over. The choke cable comes through a different hole in the firewall in the 61 than in the 62, so it might need repositioning if I want to keep the same angle of approach to the carburetor. And also the mechanism from the gas pedal to the throttle is different; I think someone had changed it in the 61, in preparation for an abandoned conversion to V8. So those are a few things that might be easier to do while the engine bays are still empty.

More significantly, I've been advised to consider pulling the oil pan to inspect the condition of rod, bearings, etc. Well I don't have a clean space for doing that and I wouldn't be able to remove the contaminants that would likely blow in and attach themselves to every oily surface. Right now the cottonwood seeds are so thick in the air they look like snow drifts at the edges of my driveway! If I want the innards inspected I'd need to haul it to a machine shop and I don't have a vehicle for hauling. And if I was going to take all the effort of getting a machine shop to open it up, wouldn't I just have them rebuild it anyway?

So I haven't fully decided on the next step but right now I'm leaning toward finishing the transplant as-is. The engine has some problems but seems to be relatively healthy. Compression range is 120 to 145, less than perfect but not unexpected for the age. I've fixed the cooling system, charging, and oil flow deficiency. After it warms up, it tends to lose power and misfire under load unless I've got the choke halfway out. So something is amiss there but I feel like maybe I can work out any remaining issues better if I have it in a car that test-drives properly. For example, with actual brakes that work. And a gas tank that holds more than a quart. And just think, with seats and a windshield, maybe I could even take it out past the gravel road to see how it acts in 3rd gear!

Hmmmm....

[Falcongek]

The official engine hoist points are the two holes that are on the intake log.
The enige would list to the ps side when hoisting.

I got mine out with some handy dandy chain and strap work.
I did remove all attachmants such as generator, starter and carb, to loose weight and to make some room to maneuvre.

If you are going to replace the master brake cylinder, do yourself a favour and swap it for the dual bowl from a 67 mustang for safety reasons.
I found out about this bolt in swap after I replaced the entire brake system, so it's still on my wish list.

A good source of inline six information is the scheldahl brothers book (hopping up the ford inline six), the website https://fordsix.com/ and the old classic inline tech archive: https://fordsix.com/ci/Tech.html.
The classic inline owner passed away, but his webstore is continued by vintage inlines https://www.vintageinlines.com/ beware that that owner is recovering from covid so he might be a little slow on responding.

I can advise you to leaf through the tech archiove, there is a wealth of information on the inline six and also some good trouble shooting and very good carb and dizzy tech.

Have fun!
Rinke

[Luva65wagon]

Jeff and I just dropped his motor (a 200) off at the machine shop yesterday for the build we're doing on his - and the shop foreman was beside himself because they are so far behind. He said so many shops folded over the past couple years that he's getting more than he can handle. He said, I hope you don't expect this anytime soon. So taking yours in for an inspection would likely require a shop with time available for this. Just from the looks of the goo in the rocker area this motor is probably long in the tooth.

That bolt doesn't look like the correct bolt for the rocker assy. I just sorted all the bolts for the abovementioned Jeff motor and it looks like all the bolts are the same and will have the narrow portion above the thread. I'll post an image of what they're supposed to look like a little later. They're out soaking in the cleaning juice right now.

Rinke is correct about the lift point on these motors. Ford just had two big hooks that wrapped up under the intake log and went into those two holes you'll find and up it went. I'm probably going to rig up a similar lifter for Jeff's swap.

Will be following your progress, so keep us posted.

[toddrichert]

The official engine hoist points are the two holes that are on the intake log.
The enige would list to the ps side when hoisting.

I got mine out with some handy dandy chain and strap work.
I did remove all attachmants such as generator, starter and carb, to loose weight and to make some room to maneuvre.

If you are going to replace the master brake cylinder, do yourself a favour and swap it for the dual bowl from a 67 mustang for safety reasons.
I found out about this bolt in swap after I replaced the entire brake system, so it's still on my wish list.

A good source of inline six information is the scheldahl brothers book (hopping up the ford inline six), the website https://fordsix.com/ and the old classic inline tech archive: https://fordsix.com/ci/Tech.html.
The classic inline owner passed away, but his webstore is continued by vintage inlines https://www.vintageinlines.com/ beware that that owner is recovering from covid so he might be a little slow on responding.

I can advise you to leaf through the tech archiove, there is a wealth of information on the inline six and also some good trouble shooting and very good carb and dizzy tech.

Have fun!
Rinke


THANK YOU for all these good resources!


I've managed to get the engine/transmission/driveshaft installed into the 61 and now it drives; same engine problems as before but at least I'm sitting in a seat when I test drive! Also with brakes and a windshield, I've even had it on the highway several times. Plenty of power to get up the hills in such a lightweight rig, but that's in spite of the 144 being grossly out of tune. Still dealing with intermittent missing and if I don't keep it half-choked then it will die. In addition, now that I've been able to drive all the way into town and back (about 20 minutes each way) I've discovered that it also begins to overheat after awhile.


Does anyone have recommendations for mechanics in the Olympia area who won't shy away from 60 year old technology? I have some mechanics here in Shelton who I think have the skills to work on it if they wanted to but when I talked to 2 of the shops I got the distinct impression that they weren't eager to deal with a "project car" and all of it's problems. Honestly I'm not looking for them to fix "all of the problems" though, just a tune-up would be nice. I've definitely maxxed out my current level of knowledge/experience and don't know really what the next step should be to make it run smoothly.


Also I'm starting a new job soon (I think) and thus my free time might be waning. And while it might be possible for me to learn about adjusting a 1-barrel Holley from scratch, I've already done the heavy lifting on this project (literally) and would love to have my engine in the hands of competent mechanic who already knows what they are doing and can transfer this engine from the "running rough" over into the "running adequate" column.


On a side note, I did fix the last of the electrical issues yesterday. When I first put the battery into that 61 with the new engine, most of the exterior lights worked but most of the dash bulbs didn't. I swapped the pressure switch over from the 62 and that gave me brake lights. Between the 61 and 62 there were 7 good dash bulbs which gave me the full 6 needed plus a spare. But 5 of them still wouldn't light up! ... so I ran down those issues one by one. The final one yesterday was just a bad hi-low floor-mount dimmer switch, and then I took it for a drive at twilight just to see ALL my dash lights working for the first time!


In other big news, I went down to SMS Auto Fabrics this week (just south of Portland) and met Doug. His website boasted the ability to make every type of interior fabric for any American car from 1940 through 2000. I had to see it for myself! He showed me a sample of his branding-iron Ranchero seat pattern that was an EXACT match for the highly detailed interior I was trying to recreate! I've only seen this particular interior (officially known as Trim No. 54 in 1961) in 3 Rancheros, ever: My dad's, plus this one I'm restoring, plus a Ranchero I saw in a youtube video earlier this year. Anyway my order for new seat covers has been placed, and I'm super excited to see the product that Doug turns out when I go down to pick it up in about a month.


Anyway that's the latest for now. I don't have plans to finish the body/paint phase until after I get it running well enough to go safely for longer distances. I certainly don't want to limit myself to just body/paint shops in my home town but I'd feel better shopping around in other cities (Olympia or Tacoma) if I knew the Ranchero could comfortably drive there.


I haven't completely ruled out learning about carburetor tuning myself, but definitely would consider hiring it out at this point, to the right shop/person.

[toddrichert]

Jeff and I just dropped his motor (a 200) off at the machine shop yesterday for the build we're doing on his - and the shop foreman was beside himself because they are so far behind. He said so many shops folded over the past couple years that he's getting more than he can handle. He said, I hope you don't expect this anytime soon. So taking yours in for an inspection would likely require a shop with time available for this. Just from the looks of the goo in the rocker area this motor is probably long in the tooth.

That bolt doesn't look like the correct bolt for the rocker assy. I just sorted all the bolts for the abovementioned Jeff motor and it looks like all the bolts are the same and will have the narrow portion above the thread. I'll post an image of what they're supposed to look like a little later. They're out soaking in the cleaning juice right now.

Rinke is correct about the lift point on these motors. Ford just had two big hooks that wrapped up under the intake log and went into those two holes you'll find and up it went. I'm probably going to rig up a similar lifter for Jeff's swap.

Will be following your progress, so keep us posted.


I know these are late replies but the bolt in the picture was actually a head bolt, not rocker assembly btw, that's why it didn't look right.


I ended up using 4 lifting points for the install, which felt about 10X more stable than I had done for the pull. Unlike the pull, with 4 lifting points that leveler actually did it's job very well and things really couldn't have gone smoother! My kids were all at work that day so I was really on my own, but it was very manageable, and couldn't have gone smoother, especially compared to the very difficult and precarious pull.


Also I figured out I wouldn't need to remove my accessories if I just held the chains away from the side of the engine. So I cut some scrap rebar down to a useful length, and ground the edges of the rebar a little bit so that the ends would snug into a chain link in each direction, like so:


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That way I was able to tip the engine front/back as needed with less chance of displacing/breaking accessories.


Without help, it took me about an hour just to get the hoist moved into place in front of the Ranchero. With one of my kids around we could have done it in minutes! But I have limits to physical exertion so I had to go very slow and careful. Often I had to stop and hook up a strap to my electric car when the hoist would get stuck and I needed to budge it a couple inches. Obviously I couldn't just straight-out tow the hoist into place... even pulling from the base the hoist is not meant for towing and would likely topple! However with a nudge here and there, and getting out of the car to manually wrestle it some more, about a dozen times in and out of the car, eventually I had it into perfect position:


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The hoist itself looks crooked in that picture but I was able to visually confirm that the engine itself was ideally aligned, pointing right down the center of the engine bay. And it had to be because once I got the Ranchero up underneath it, it would be impossible to get the electric car close enough to nudge an adjustment. And I might not be able to physically move the hoist by myself if it needed to move again.


Well all that preparation paid off... it was so perfectly aligned that when I rolled the Ranchero up, I didn't even have to make a last minute steering adjustment, and both legs of the hoist cleared the suspension on both sides, even though there was barely any clearance to be had!


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That was June 16. By the next day I had hooked up enough stuff to fire that engine up and take the 61 on a little test drive for the very first time! So I officially declared 6-17-2021 to be the RBD of this 1961 Ranchero. Re-Birth-Day. Yeah I think I made that one up.


Anyway it's been over 30 years since I've driven one of these and I forgot just how big the steering wheel is! Like *comically* large, like a steering wheel in a school bus. Man it's just been so much fun to experience these memories again...


I've been fixing up this and that ever since, and got the hood back on, and drove it to town for the first highway drive. I found out you can print off 3-day trip permits right from home now! So I didn't have to wait until the licensing office was open, I got a trip permit printed on my home printer on a SUNDAY of all things.


When the online trip-permit form asked what license plate was on the vehicle, it said that if there was no plate then I should type NOPLATE into the space. But I realized in that moment that I already have the perfect license plates for this car! My own original vanity plates from the 80s... I had bought vanity plates to go on dad's original Ranchero back in the 80s when he gave me that very first car, and these plates haven't been used in decades. But now that I'm trying to rebuild a mirror twin of my dad's Ranchero, well what could be better? I wasn't sure where they were at first but I found them sitting on a shelf in a stack of many license plates I had saved from over the years:


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As a bonus, this plate has an 87 sticker, which helps date the plate as a first year issue of the new Mt Rainier design! I've never really been motivated to put these personalized plates back into circulation before, but with this project it just seems perfect. Especially when I drove to my dad's house to show him this work-in-progress and he got to see his own name sprawled on the front and back of it!